Jeep Sliders Showdown: Bolt-On Fail or Trail-Ready? | Jeep Talk Show
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All right. Well, let’s, uh, let’s get started here real quick. Um, and, uh, just to get into it, we’re talking anyway, so we might as well make
(Explosion)
episode. And tonight we have one subject. If we run out of things to talk about on this one subject, then we’ll just open it up to talk about anything. Uh, so, uh, I do that quite often, uh, but it always seems that we fill the fill the hour anyway. So, uh, uh, Greg is one of the, uh, individuals that responded to the ad of, uh, be the new Josh. And, uh, we actually got two people, April and, uh, gosh, out of it. Uh, Josh is on the, uh, the flagship episode on Tuesday, April’s on the flagship on Thursday, if you haven’t called those yet.
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So we’re going to, uh, Greg actually brought this up in one of the recent, uh, flagship episodes about, uh, and I didn’t know this, it makes sense, but I didn’t know this sliders. And I think it actually started because of Matt. If you guys, uh, on discord, you’ve seen the problems that Matt had had, but, uh, uh, breaking some, uh, uh, uh, body to frame bolts, uh, that had red loctite on them, which I was surprised that it, uh, not that it had red loctite, but the only, the front ones have read the other, all the other four have a blue, I don’t know what it is for a two door. I don’t know if there’s the same amount of body mounts on a two door. Uh, but anyway, uh, started the discussion on sliders, cause that’s what Matt was putting on. And, uh, Greg says that if you don’t weld on the sliders, it’s cosmetic. Uh, Greg, uh, state your position. So everybody, okay.
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It’s, it was my position that after having experienced the pitfalls and drawbacks of getting any kind of step rail or slider that attaches via the pinch weld and body mounts, that if you intend to sincerely use them while on the trail, you’re going to hate yourself for mounting those things on there, no matter how good a deal you got or how cool they look, anything that you’re depending upon the vehicle to sustain, you know, the weight, like if you’re pivoting around a rock, if you’re falling off a ledge, shit happens, you did it on purpose, whatever those types of things need to be mounted to the chassis. It’s the same concept as the difference between a sport cage from the factory that’s body mounted versus an aftermarket cage that you tie into the frame. So that it can be taken out of context if it’s, if it’s not, you know, presented in such a light because everybody’s version of what’s hardcore and their wheeling style is completely different. So what I do with this rig behind me is radically different than what the wife does with hers over there. You know, so her factory rails are completely fine because she might curb check the thing and that’d be about the end of it. Whereas in my case, I am literally bashing them to bits and the body mount stuff will not hold up to that abuse. Will not.(…) And I don’t think I have to tell anybody here, if you have a differing opinion, please state it with all the gusto that you have as, as much as you want to defend it. So I got big skin and you’re not going to hurt my feelings.
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We want, we want to get information out here.(…) So I don’t, I don’t have feelings either, but I will say I’m running the motor bill sliders that are tied into the body bolts and the body, the same sliders as Zabo’s running on his crazy rig, same sliders that Matt’s installing. And Matt’s buddy has several JOUs, JKUs. I did a little research on where I got them. Gin right, motor bill, metal, flow, JCR, let me go down the list. And they all have them marketed as sliders that tie into that. I beat the living shit out of mine. I put the whole Jeep down on them and never had any problems.(…) They are mounted to the body bolts underneath and kind of go through. And so I think nobody would disagree that weld ons are the cream of the crop. Like that’s where you want to go. If you’re going to be doing just pure rock buggy type stuff.(…) But I think that Tony, what you just said that I was questioning was that you called this style bad. Like it won’t work. Like this is not the way you want to go. And the reason why I was bringing it up was because hell anybody’s going to be doing research, if you go out there and you do research, like I said, all the major manufacturers market them out of the way, well, they run it on TerraMoto V1 with the bolt ons, they can go to weld ons until V2, they generate. So they run king of the hammers with them mounted that way. So it was just, if you’re doing research on that and you’re trying to find them, I don’t think that you can call it bad if somebody is running it this way. I think there’s definitely, like you said, it’s relative rock buggies versus dual purpose rigs or whatever you want to call it. But with so many top notch vendors out running that style,(…) I mean,(…) it’s just, there’s something the industry was missing when that kind of thing was there. Was the question. I’m not talking about manner of the pinch seams, like the factory, um, we rails that that’s how I’m talking about. I’m talking about the ones we have are actually mounted to the frame, but they’re mounted via bolts through the body bolts. They’re not welded on. And that’s, that was what I was referring to in the, in the discord. So something Greg told me, uh, he was either before the recording or during the recording, I don’t remember, but, uh, Greg, you told me that you have on, on your Jeep, you have that, that style of a slider on your Jeep. And, uh, tell, I’ll tell the audience here what, what you have to do after.
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So these are my poison spider free to me.
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Rocker slider armor. What do you want to call them? So there’s your, there’s your money shot, poison spider, blah, blah, blah. And as you can see, if you keep watching.
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Drivers door trying to open and close. Over the body mounted slider.
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So, and if you look a little bit closer, you can tell that they’re not there to protect the rocker anymore because the rocker, the doors, the rest of the sheet metal, it’s all trash there’s this thing’s a raisin. When you say body bounded though, when you say body mounted.
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So they are mounted in the body mounting bolts on both sides,(…) front to back.
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And every, every time I put the weight of the Jeep on them, this is where I end up. You can see, I haven’t pulled them down from the last time I went out a year ago. That’s a critical bit. He has to bend them down after a wheeling trip. I have. And now granted it’s not exactly a fair comparison to a, please. This is no insult. No, no dig in anybody. This isn’t a regular Jeep. This thing is far surpassed what you would normally expect to find with this kind of a setup on it, because the only reason I put them on here, they were free. They were, they were given to me. So I stuck them on just to get rid of my factory rails that were just as chewed up as the rest of the sheet metal. So by the time you add the Dana 80 axles, the 45 inch tires, the custom suspension that I’ve done a blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, I’m north of 6,400 pounds, carboy easily, this thing is long fat and wide. It is, it is. I’ve just, I’ve just got the Dynatrax 60 stuff like that. And I’m at 6,200 pounds. So I mean, mine’s pretty heavy too. And I’ve, I’ve, I’ve laid on these sliders pretty heavy. Now I don’t know if maybe Moto builds with the 360 steel are just stronger than poison spider. I will guarantee you the Moto builds are stronger than the poison spider. I promise you that. Yes. That was the point I was making was it’s not purely a mounting setup that can have them just, just because they’re mounting, they’re not going to be able to get out of the body. Bull says, I mean, the bad sliders and it won’t work. And it’s, it’s, and again, that’s the, that wasn’t what I was trying to say. It’s not that it’s bad. It’s that you have to understand the difference between how much you’re literally trying to punish it every time you go out versus how much you’re spending on it and what the expectations are in this case for what I’m doing. This particular setup does not work right. It it’s, it’s, I’m asking more than the component can provide. But simply to simply say, welded is better. I mean, welded is always better, but I simply say that we’re the only ones that are greater welded is it’s just not a hundred percent true because every manufacturer does different. Some are, some might cheap out on the, on the mounting hardware or whatnot. I mean, like a company that does really, you know, research in their engineering and research and development, how they’re making sure that when you land on something that, that force is being distributed differently. I mean, one guy could have an L bracket and the other one could have, you know, a boat, a boat style gusset in there or something that’s going to, you know, transfer the weight differently than. Right. And, and there are designs out there that are much, much better than this particular version. I do not argue that at all. What I will say is that just my, my standard, you know, and now my standard comparison is always going to fall back to a factory Jeep cage, which it’s not a cage, it’s, it’s a bar, it’s a roll bar. It’s you smash it once it’s done, you have to unbolt it, start over with a new one, it’s compromised versus a chassis mounted roll cage and actual cage worlds of difference in what each one of the, they both serve the same purpose, but the aftermarket or custom roll cage is always going to be a hundred percent more effective and safer than a factory bar. That’s bolted to the body in several points versus being. Depending on who installed it. Yeah. And you can also discussion in a perfect world installed professionally and done right. These particular poison spider. Flighters bolt to the three body mounts up and down the side, and then a few bolts through the pink seam, just like the factory ones. That’s it. There’s nothing else supporting these things. It’s, it’s like my argument about why I don’t like body armor. You Swiss cheese, the same component that you’re trying to save from damage. You basically destroy your body panels to install rib nuts and put body armor on. And then people act surprised when they bash into something, but thinking it’s going to protect the Jeep and it just, the foundation is Swiss cheese, sheet metal, guess what? That’s all that’s holding up your arm. It’s not like it’s tied to the chassis or the crash bars or anything else. It’s just hanging off the sheet metal. So there’s a limit to what body armor will, will take and protect you from. So it’s the same thing with these. And if I had to go back and never put these on, I would rather just have nothing there than have these because they’re more of a hindrance and a hassle. They look cool. They sort of do what they’re supposed to do. And if this was again, if I wasn’t doing like it was mentioned earlier, if I’m not doing full on buggy stuff all the time, then this wouldn’t be an issue. If I were still on Dana 44s and 37s, they’d be fine because I wouldn’t be pushing the rig that hard. So the point I was trying to make, this is what something we talked about. I think it was on the today’s flagship episode that was released. You never know when something’s going to happen. Unintended. Right. We never know when something unintended is going to happen. So I thought it was important that we have this discussion because it is something that’s very well accepted in the industry. I think that it is very well accepted in the industry because, uh, not everybody can weld, not everybody wants to weld. Uh, they just want to get bolt on and have it look cool and provide some protection. So, uh, and there’s nothing wrong with doing it that way. If that’s, you know, if it’s a budget constraint, if it’s, you know, an installation skill constraints, something like that, I mean, it’s fine. So long as you understand the difference. I should have contacted Zabo because Zabo’s build is not your everyday build. So I’m kind of surprised he didn’t go with a weld on. Actually, I’m surprised Mike at Platinum Off-Road didn’t recommend weld on. Um, but he did. But you could say the same thing when it comes to roll cages. I mean, we, we had the conversation a while back about roll cages. There’s bolt and roll cages, and then there’s weld and roll, roll, weld and roll cages. I mean, one is definitely going to be, but the weld is probably going to be, as long as it’s done correctly, it’s definitely going to be better. But you’re also talking about what’s the percentage of people that off-road now, what’s now out of that percentage, what’s the percentage of those people that are, that are out there hitting buggy lines, you know, so like, it only, it only takes one mistake on a level three or level four. That’s on its side around its lid. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you’re, you know, you’re second guessing that, well, I’m not going to push it that hard. I’m not going to go out here and act the fool. And the split second that you misaligned by, you know, a few inches or, or don’t hear your spot or miss, you know, it’s, we see the videos guys all the time where people make screwups like that. And you never know when that kind of thing is going to happen. So for a guy like me doing what I’m doing, I prefer to recommend
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and for like what I want to change about my own setup, I, I would rather have something that is correctly tied into the chassis that I don’t have to worry about. It’s not going to fail. You know, it’s, it’s, it’s depending upon the body mounts and those pinch welds to support the weight of the Jeep. I’m not saying you can’t get away with it a few times. And like I said, a quality set of something better, because these are the post sellout. If you guys are in the know, these are not the original poison spider. These are the post sellout poison spider versions. So they’re nowhere near on the quality of what poison spider reputation was, you know, built on. So if these were like the ones that Mike has for Moto built, that he was mentioning a minute ago on his rig, those things are substantially more beefy than the poison spider version. I guarantee it. Mike just came back from a, what was it? The, um,
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over in Arkansas hot Springs and he, he missed it on a line and he took a four foot fall straight into one of his and shoved it up into the body and bent the shit out of it. It’s bad enough. He’s having, he sent me pictures earlier cause we were talking about this. He’s having to replace it because he, that, that was an extreme example. Like Tony was just mentioning, he didn’t mean to do it. It was completely an accident,(…) but it was a four foot drop with the entire weight of the vehicle coming down on that thing at this all at once. And it killed it. Absolutely killed it. So there’s extreme examples, both directions. Again, you have to be honest with yourself or if you’re selling it to somebody, if you’re in the business of selling these parts, be honest with, you know, what it will actually put up with versus your driving style or your choice of terrain. So I, I, I know way meant to sound like it was,(…) my idea is superior to yours, blah, blah, blah. It’s just the fact of what the crawfish is exactly it. It’s, it’s, it’s the, it’s the foundation of what’s supporting the component. You know, like you wouldn’t use seven 16th hardware on your axle joints or excuse me, your suspension link joints.(…) Cause you know that even on a stock Jeep, that’s not enough hardware to put up with any kind of decent off-roading. It’s just not substantial enough. I’m curious what Gregor Rich has to say about the subject.(…) Oh, I can go down a hole, rabbit hole if you want me to. Absolutely.
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So a hundred percent he’s got, he’s he’s in and he’s got the best name in the world. So he already knows some shit.(…) But he’s a quality set of weld ons is going to be and quality, right? Cause you can have garbage weld on too. I’ve seen people weld muddler tubing on and think that it’s good, but
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there’s downfalls with weld on too, especially unless it’s detached from the body because you need the body frame separation to get a, you know, a higher quality ride and even more flex. However, there are some really substantial sets that tie into not only the pinch seam, but the body mount and then up the body. Like the old, the original poison spider ones, which he mentioned, you know, they were some of the strongest things you could. And yes, you had to put rib nuts in your body, but they went into structural areas and then it distributed the load across the thing. So quality engineered set.(…) And I noticed since JL, we’ve gotten away from the quality engineered sets, right? Everybody back in the day, JCR, metal cloak, everybody made ones that Riven up into the body and attached to the pinch seam and attention to the, but attached to the body mounts and you know, went through all the rigmaroles and then you can still have the body versus frame flex, which actually gives you a better off road characteristics.
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However,
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the aftermarket in large has gotten rid of those and you see those like cheap Chinese garbage versions, like he’s got, you know, after this, the buyout, like when poison spider was owned by Clifton sleigh, it was the best armor you could buy. And then later,
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and then Larry bought it, you know, on the steps of the courthouse and turned it into a marketing genius of a company and still produced high quality parts. And there’s, there’s lots of companies out there. I mean, even rock slide engineering, you look at some of their easiest, the earliest stuff, and it did the same thing and attached to the body mount, the pinch seam and Riven nutted into the body in structural areas. And you could drop those things off at eight foot ledges and slam into boulders and never have a scratch.(…) But as the ease of the aftermarket, they wanted quick, easy installation. Everybody started just going to the pinch seam and maybe body mouth and things just don’t get as strong as like a true fabricated set.(…) So, so you’re, you’re a hundred percent correct. And everybody’s opinion has been correct on some level or another, but a true quality engineered set that ties into the body and multiple points can be just as strong and more beneficial than just a well done set. Unless you’re just doing buggy shit all day long. And then who fucking cares because you’re probably not driving it on the road. Like, you know, the average person.(…) Right.(…) So, so yeah,(…) sometimes right. And that’s why I said I can go down a rabbit hole because there, there really are some super quality stuff out there that,
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but the installation is a lot harder and you got to have a good Jeep to start with. Right. You can’t. Oh, and it’s also fair to note that the, the, the gauge and quality of the sheet metal in the JL and JT tubs versus the JK tubs is substantially less, you know, FCA work. They’re ass. I mean, you know, it’s got aluminum doors, aluminum hood, composite tailgate, and then really light gauge steel body tub. And it’s, you know, that, that is still the foundation. So like the JK version of the one he’s just describing that has the, the rocker armor that goes on and provides additional mounting points for the slider itself on a JK is going to actually do a little bit better with harder hits than it would on a JL just because the foundation is stronger on the JK from a material level. So, well, for a material level a hundred percent, but not from a structural level, the J the JL body is stiffer and stronger than the JK. And it’s, it’s almost an identical tub. The doors are fucking worthless, even though they weigh just as much, but they’re aluminum. And there’s some other worthless components. And yeah, the, the magnesium rear rear tire carrier don’t even get me started on that.
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Yeah, we had those stock on the JKs too. Well, yeah, but they went for my doors, cause I’ve got the power windows and all that shit. All four of my doors total about 300 pounds. If you, if you weigh all four of them, I mean that’s I’m, I’m 6 1 2 55. Just taking the doors off the Jeep to hit the trail is taking me plus out of the Jeep as far as sprung weight, which is, you know, the, the jail, the jail ones are like that part of it, the lightweight is cool, but they damn sure aren’t going to hold up if you’re not pulling them off, you know, if you bang into shit with them, you’re going to regret it. So. Oh yeah. And the, the, the JL does have a much superior cage than the JK it’s, it’s much stronger. It’s much safer in the event of a rollover. And if somebody would build a really quality rocker guards that and actually tie into the base of that B pillar so that it would spread the load even further and into the outside face, but the actual structure. Yeah. Yeah. Instead of just put, instead of just putting a red nut and do a sleeve and tie it all the way in and Oh yeah, that would be great. But again, now we’re back into engineering and getting a company to do it. Like, I’d love to do it. I just can’t afford, you know, we’re already launching enough products on that. I can’t afford to go down that road, but a hundred percent, you know, a good quality set of rocker guards and not, you know, the worst example is the ones that he showed in the first place because they are, they’re the cheap Chinese garbage poisons fighter. It’s a design, the way these things are designed, they basically pivot on the pinch weld.(…) They, does everybody remember JC Whitney?(…) Oh yeah. It is the JC Whitney version of off-roading.
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Absolutely. Which is a downfall because poison spider, like Clifton, and I love Clifton to death, but Clifton started this amazing company and he only wanted to build this high quality true armor and he did an amazing job. And then when Larry got it, Larry turned it into this powerhouse of the company until he sold it. And then, you know, four wheel parts just ruined it. But same scenario with Yukon and Randy’s. I mean, you guys can remember 10 years ago, Yukon was, was one of the top five easily without question, you know, and we’re so far away from that now. It’s sad, but they’re still the most expensive retail priced aftermarket gear supplier on the, you know, out there. Yeah. And now they own Dynatrack and you know, so Dynatrack is going to… I heard some feelings on one boy’s post about that. He was bragging about his new Dynatrack axles and I was like, I just, he’s like, I’m sure glad I got mine equipped with Dynatrack. And I’m like, I’m sure glad mine aren’t full of Yukon parts.(…) Like, you know, he goes, what?
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Yeah. If you didn’t know. Oh, that’s one of the things that’s good about this show is we could bring this information to people. I didn’t know until recently about the Yukon. Hey, Tony, did you see the text I sent you? Yeah, I did. It’s just a screenshot, but Marvin is down in Mexico. They’re doing a 24 hour Helen back. So he couldn’t join the show and Ian is busy right now. Let me just spend it. Okay. But both of them said that they’d come. They just, they’re busy right now. So I apologize that I couldn’t get them on. No, it’s not a problem. I’m glad that’s all you can do.
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Hey, I got a, I got a question. Whoops. Or on your, on your, I’ll get a little closer if anybody’s aware, which,
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well, Derek’s figuring out what to say. I’m going to give a small preview to everybody else. Turn your camera on, Greg.(…) Oh, oh shit. I didn’t realize it wasn’t on.
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Are you going to let me talk now, Brett?
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Yeah, but first, me, here’s the JK ones. The very first set ever off of the press.
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They’re, they’re pre-grained. The tools go out for grain tomorrow, but this was the first set in the world of the JK ones.
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Are we going to have them for Jeep invasion? I am going, I’m doing that. So I’m going to a meeting tomorrow at noon with the grain house. If they can get them grain,
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they told me within seven to 10 days where they can get the graining done. So it’ll be the identical to the JK. Then yes, I’ll bring probably 50 or a hundred sets to the Jeep invasion. That’ll be the first place in the world where they’re available.
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But so, you know, finally, here’s JK ones. Now, now go, Derek.
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Is that okay? Do I have, do I have the floor?
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You have the floor. All right. So, um,
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so on a weld on, you wouldn’t like, you know, that’s great. You weld them on there. They’re on there, but if they get bent, now you either have to cut off, you know, cut the welds off and put some new ones on. Um,
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or are you concerned at all with welding to that frame?
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And then getting that frame hot,(…) and then you’re, you’re, you’re taking that risk of burning the paint off the inside of that frame that you cannot paint back. So well, there’s no paint on the frame. It’s just E-coat. So you could run paint inside the frame, but I would recommend, um, you know, as kind of a nerd fabricator,
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I would never just take the tube and weld it directly to the frame because the frame is relatively thin. Um, and your tube is probably going to be a little bit beefier. I would always make some form of a fish plate that I attached to the frame first, and then add that rocker to that. And I like, um, the few sets that I’ve made,(…) I usually make a essentially a male end that sticks off of the frame.
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And then the rocker guard itself, I will pin it. So I can put it over the male end. So I give it the female side, I can put it over and I can pin it. That way, if it gets damaged, you don’t have to cut it back off. You can literally take a couple very high quality, you know, grade eight bolts out, remove the whole thing and either replace it. But, you know, if you’re building a high quality set like that, um, it’s the sacrificial lamb, right? I would much rather destroy a couple of pieces of DOM than cave in the side of the Jeep. Bingo, bingo. There you go.(…) But you’re not, you’re not going to be concerned with rusting the inside of that frame when you, when you burn that E-coat off. Well, um, usually what I do, spend a lot of time in the water on the coast.(…) Well, like I’m in Michigan, so everything is creates rust. So anytime I do anything to the frame, just like this one behind me, um, I mean, you guys have kind of, some of you guys have followed along massive amounts of welding and cutting and grinding on this frame. So then it went, they got sandblasted inside and out. We hit it with steel shot. And then we coded it internally.(…) Um, you know, there’s a couple of different kits you can buy and you being a painter should know they have the big stems with a little fan tip that you can run up the frame and you can actually paint the inside of the frame. Um, I always do that. Anytime I weld on a frame, the first thing I do is put basically a roto rooter inside of there and clean all the shit and debris out and then go back and prep it, uh, epoxy it and paint it because in Michigan we have to worry about rust.
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What about cavity wax?
(…)
You can do the cavity wax as long as you keep up on it. That’s not appropriate for a family show. Uh,
(…)
gents, I got, I got a dip. I mean, my presence is being requested. No, you’re the new host of a show. You got to stay till the better end. He gets in there. You can’t bring on this controversial subject and then bail. They put the bed guys. Come on. We’ll talk shit about you while you’re gone. So you have to listen and see what was said. Oh yeah.
(…)
I’ll talk, talk, get it on.
(…)
Well, man, I got called out last week for all the armor and stuff that I have, but I wasn’t all good. See you Greg. You’ll be good.
(…)
You’re going to have to start calling to hit. What’s his last name?
(…)
Nichols. Yeah. Was it Nicole? Yeah. You’re going to have to call him Greg N otherwise. Otherwise I’m going to get all fucked up.
(…)
That don’t take my every time somebody says Greg, I’m like, yeah, squirrel.
(…)
Yeah.
(…)
Yeah. Well, and the whole reason I bring that up. I was here first motherfucker. You can call him dude. You can be Greg one. Yeah. Greg nickel.
(…)
Um, no, I mean, the only reason I bring it up though, uh, Tony is like, you know, for, for the average people that want to go to a shop and pay to, to get this on. Cause it’s not a, you know, a, something most people are going to DIY.(…) Um,
(…)
you know, I mean, that’s to me, that’s things like, you know, Greg, number one is, is always going to do his, you know, the right way and paint the frame. But, um, your average people, especially around here, you know, even your average shop is not going to, that’s what I was going to say. I don’t think it would either. The TJ frames were notorious for rusting without welding on them. So yeah. And I would, I would a hundred percent advocate, um, put the best ones you can on the, the, the quality bolt on ones, especially for TJ or there’s way better ones for TJ than there are for JK and JL, but, um, just put a really good quality set on it and put the best set you can afford and enjoy it. If, if you’ve got the cheap Chinese knockoffs, you know, cause the, the set that he showed was literally the worst ones you could even talk about.(…) So. We’re in a good set that uses as a, as a, as a base.
(…)
Well, one of the, one of the earlier sets of poison spiders, you know, something that was two to three years older than that would have been great. And you can bash them into boulders all day long and never have an issue, but you know, that particular set, yeah, you might as well just talk about some quadri-tech shit or some JC Whitney shit. Rough country. And like, easy on the quadri-tech, easy. No, no, I love quadri-tech and I’m friends with quadri-tech, but their private branded stuff is literally the bargain basement shit. It’s a profit deal.
(…)
They have a couple of JL bumpers that they’ve come out with that are actually stout, but their rocker guards are muffler tubing. Their doors, you know, their tube doors are muffler tubing. None of them, you know, none of it’s substantial stuff. And
(…)
the people that work at quadri-tech know that. So I’m not saying anything that people don’t know. But I absolutely love quadri-tech. I mean, I build their fucking show cars.
(…)
But honestly, their, their private label, quadri-tech rocker guards, I wouldn’t, I wouldn’t bolt them on and expect to go off road. I’d bolt them on and expect to drive to the mall.
(…)
I’ll keep you in the loop. I don’t like how they mounted. Like, I mean, you really drill a hole and put a damn nutsert in it. That’s not gonna, to me, that’s not gonna hold up. I mean, now there’s eight, eight nutserts per per rock slider, but I still don’t see it. So it’s a, okay. So that’s a different rock slider than the ones that, like the ones that they forced me to put on the YJL fucking garbage. Well, now, well, you’re, you’re, you’re on a JL there, you know, I’m, I’m, I’m in the T when we put metal cloak on the JL and it’s, it seems really well. Um, but now for the TJ, you know, you drill eight holes in the frame and put nutsert. So there’s nothing going to a pinch. Well, it’s, it’s bolting straight to frame.(…) Um, I wouldn’t like that at all. I wouldn’t like that either. I’d rather him be on the body on a TJ. Yeah. I’ve got the, you know, me, I’ve, I’ve got the gen right ones, the steel gen right ones. And, uh, and it’s got, it’s got bolt through, it goes, it’s bolt it’s in his plates, uh, like on the bottom, like under the bottom of the door, there’s a plate that goes on the inside of the door. And then you drill all the way through and, uh, and then the whole line up. Did you do the TJ ones where you have to take a sledgehammer and beat the whole rocker guard in, or do you do the ones that cover it? I’ve got the bolt sides. I didn’t beat, I didn’t beat the rocker guard. And you just, I just took some, uh, some, uh, some pliers and just bent that little bottom piece over. Yeah. Oh yeah. They had a, they had a set of boat side ones. Um, and it was, you know, and we’re talking five years ago now, but it would not go on. Like I couldn’t get it all the way up to the door. We’re supposed to go without literally taking a 10 pound sledgehammer and beating the whole bottom of the rocker guard in two inches. Um, good God, that’s a lot.(…) Now, once it was done, right? So an hour and a half of swinging a
(…)
incredibly strong and incredibly beautiful, but most people don’t have the balls.(…) And I, and I hate to say it that way, but to, to install that set, right? Cause you had two options. You could either beat the whole bottom in or you could cut it off. Um, I chose to beat it in because I wanted the strength and the structure of the metal there. But once they were done,(…) absolutely beautiful. Like I was really, really impressed with them. Um, I think some of the best TJ rocker guards I’ve ever seen, which is a downfall that the company went out of business, but it was a Kilby enterprises. Kilby enterprises made some amazing rocker guards for TJ,(…) um, as well as nth degree, nth degree, he made some, some just bitchin ones. But when AEV bought it, they just continued them right away. Uh, cause they were not cost effective to manufacture,(…) but no, there’s, there’s awesome rocker guards, right? And, and
(…)
and buy whatever you can afford, buy whatever you like the look of, but just pay attention, right? You’re, you’re not going to get something like what he showed, which just bolts to the pinch seam and it’s very simplistic.
(…)
Those aren’t going to, I mean, the factory ones are just as strong. So,(…) you know, pay attention to what you buy and what you can afford and, and enjoy it. But you know, I think the hardest part, and I think what a lot of people took away from that in the very beginning, me included was the first statement. And the first statement was high quality, well done ones or nothing.
(…)
Right? Um, you know, cause the, all bolt on ones are garbage. And here’s my explanation and here’s my example. And that’s what caused us all to, you know, hairs on the back of our neck to stand up and you know, the,
(…)
the comments to ensue. So from all the way to, that’s as good podcasting. No, it was great. It really was because it caused reactions from everybody. And it caused a lot of, yeah, we need opinions. We need to get this information out to the people that aren’t here on the round table that just our viewers and listeners so that they’ll know. My takeaway on this is the same as it was before. Um, you can do something that’s not weld on, but you also can get yourself in a situation where you wish you had. Now, if you’re not taking off road or not doing anything, that’s a super challenging to the rig, then it sounds like you don’t really need the weld on thing. And there was a lot of information about the weld on stuff. I didn’t realize what you were talking about, Greg, where you were, uh, you, you don’t weld straight to the frame. You actually put something on there so you could take them off if you want to, uh, that, that sounds like a really good idea. Well, that’s just over engineering it, but I would never weld directly to the frame for a structural bash component because the frame isn’t as strong as what you’re attaching to it. Right. And just like Derek said, you can create hotspots or brittle spots in the frame, um, by welding to it. And then you’re going to run into multiple issues. One, the rest issue to, if you, when,(…) when you take two pieces of metal, let’s say you have two pieces of mild steel and you weld them together, that actual weld is brittle. So, and here, I can actually show you. Well, another point too is frames are meant to actually move. Like, if you look at a truck, yeah, flex like if you look at a pickup truck going over a rough road, the bed and the body will move. Look like they move separately. There’s meant to do that.
(…)
So I don’t know if you can see this, but you should be able to. Yay. So, let me find a good one.(…) Um, I’m not concerned with what the weld looks like. I’m concerned with what’s happening around the weld. So you can see it kind of here and get right in the right angle.(…) So
(…)
this weld, do you see the discoloration to the metal above it?
(…)
So that discoloration is actually a change in the metallurgy.(…) So when you put this weld in, this weld is running at, you know, 2,500 Fahrenheit.
(…)
And you know, somewhere right around there. So it’s at the melting point of steel. So this weld is well above 2,000 degrees,(…) uh, probably below 3,000. And that discoloration is actually a change to the metal energy inside the metal. So this is mild steel and this is mild steel.(…) This part in between is now, uh, essentially kind of like a hardened steel. So it is brittle. So let’s say you’ve welded a tube. Say my, my lung burner here is a tube and I’ve welded it to this piece of steel. I can get it to stand up. So if there’s a weld joint at the bottom there, you know, all the way around what that tube is welded to the metal,(…) you’re going to have the exact same thing where you have that discoloration.(…) And it’s going to be, because it was super heated and it cooled down too fast. So you’re going to actually have what they call either a hotspot or a brittle spot. So if this takes a hit, let’s say, you know, this is part of your rocker guard and this takes a massive hit up here at the top.
(…)
It’s not going to, it’s not going to be able to bend at the base or the brittle part because that part is stronger than the rest of the metal.(…) So it’s going to have to bend slightly up the shaft a little bit. If, if all the load transfers to that weld,
(…)
it can snap the weld. It can break it. So that’s what he’s talking about with brittle. So when you weld with something, it gets those hotspots or brittle spots. And if you don’t normalize it, then you run into an issue. Like if you, if you research NASCAR chassis or full race car chassis, you realize they have to, after they build those chassis in the roll cage, they have to put the entire chassis into an oven and bring it up to like 1800, 1800 Fahrenheit, and then very slowly drop it over several hours to normalize the entire thing and to, to get all the molecules of the metal to kind of re-sauffin up and realign. So you don’t have, so you don’t have some that are super tight and hard and then others that are loose and relaxed. They all have to be loose and relaxed. And then others that are loose and relaxed, they all have to be the same level of relaxed. Otherwise in one of those 200 mile per hour crashes, that cage could essentially snap apart like Legos instead of bending and deforming. So you have to normalize it. And in the off road world, it’s very, very rare to see any of that normalization of metal only in high end race car versus that happened. All right. Let’s take a look at this. They’re still in barns like days of thunder taught me.
(…)
Yeah.(…) All right. So let’s take a quick pause here and see if anybody else wants to jump in on this conversation. Lots of good information. And I’m sure it’s generated some sort of comment or question. Uh, don’t, don’t feel like you got to ask, but if you do, uh, if you do have a question up in there or a statement,
(…)
well, I was going to say earlier, like I’ve got the kind that go in at my body mounts and bolt in where the body mounts are and then bolt to the body on the TJ and they’re not the old poisoned
(…)
fighters. They’re a direct copy of the old poison spiders. My brother and I as the old poison fighters and we can’t tell the difference other than no logo,
(…)
but they’ve worked really well and I’ve bounced fine off a lot of junk.
(…)
I’m curious what Rich has to say about all this too.
(…)
Come on, Rich.
(…)
Can you ask over to the camera and start talking?
(…)
Rich is probably taking a wheel off the XJ. He’s working on it. Yeah.(…) No, it’s, it’s sitting outside.
(…)
It’s not happy with me right now. Um,
(…)
I don’t really have too much to add. Uh, I think Greg was pretty well explained it. Which one Greg one or Greg two? Yeah. Yes. Green eggs and ham.(…) Um,(…) yeah, I mean, there’s, the way I see it, it all depends on what you’re doing with the vehicle in the end. Um,(…) you’re going to start doing some hardcore stuff and you’re, you, you think you’re going to be in a position where you can have that accidental slip and fall off the ground. Or you can have that accidental slip and fall in your slider.(…) Then make sure you get a good reputable company,(…) uh, and sliders that people can have bounced for.
(…)
Cause I’ve, I’ve seen some that are, uh, name brand ones that,
(…)
that look nice. And for the most part they hold up, but once you get a good hit on them, the whole body of the, the, the tub is, uh, gets a crease in it. So now you got a body damage.
(…)
So there’s, there’s some trade-offs. I, I would, I would lean more towards the welding them on. If you’re going to do the harder stuff, um,
(…)
a lot of the more kind of bolt on options, especially like the rock slides, those are great.
(…)
Um, those I’ve seen those things take some hits for sure.
(…)
So definitely the earlier ones, the earlier rock slides were just bomb proof. Oh yeah. I’ve seen some of the new ones, uh, bend a little easier than I would, I would like. Yeah. Yeah, that’s true.(…) But yeah, definitely, definitely get a good reputable company and do your research.(…) If try to see what other people have done, especially in your area, um, cause that’s how you know what’s going to hold up and
(…)
what’ll just take out the body incising more issues.
(…)
So, so I have a question for everybody here. Do you have, uh, I’ve seen them called rock guards and rock sliders. I think it’s kind of like, uh, suppressors either being suppressors or silencers. I like to call them suppressors and not silencers. Uh, but does anybody here have some rock sliders that now they’re, uh, wondering if they are the, what they thought they had that maybe you need to upgrade or you’re concerned about what you’re running on your, on your Jeep now.
(…)
Well, I’m still running the, well, I got the recon, so I got the Ruby rails with the step attached to it and hell they’ve taken some pretty hard hits and they’ll hold an upgrade to me for me.
(…)
I’m not concerned.
(…)
Before I went to the ones I have now, um,(…) the ones that I had, they were the only place that they mounted was at the body mounts. And, uh, and, and I didn’t realize it until somebody pointed out to me, uh, actually is when I was showing, uh, I was, uh, I was showing pictures of my tummy tuck and, uh, somebody had commented on there said, Ooh, I’d get rid of them, them rock sliders. Cause as soon as they take a hit, it’s going to act like a lever and it’s, it’s just kind of like a, like a pry bar and it’s just going to pop those, it’s going to pop your pop your body right off your frame. And when I looked at it and I was like, holy crap, you’re right. I mean, I did, I never even thought about that. And that’s one of the reasons why I went with the ones that I got in, uh, cause I liked the way they, I mean, this, I don’t know, I don’t have any bolts or are in the gen right ones. There’s like 30 bolts. I don’t know. It’s, but a lot of it is it’s both sides. It’s sandwiches. So you got the body panel and you got steel on one side and then steel on the other side. And then it bolts at sandwiches is together. And it’s, it’s on the side. It’s on the bottom. Uh, you know, it’s the whole thing now. They, and it, and it does not connect to the, the body mount locations. Hey, Rick, is that, is that just bolting to the tub itself? Is that bolting through the tub with a steel plate?
(…)
Yes. It’s bolting through the tub on the, it’s bolting through the tub on the sides right under the door. Uh, there’s like, uh, I want to say four or five that are, you know, kind of spread out there across the top of the, uh, of the rock rail there. And then, uh, and then there’s,
(…)
I don’t know how many on the across the, uh, there’s a bunch on the bottom and then it’s just the way it, the way it, uh,(…) standardly it’s a standard link TJ. There should be seven on the bottom and I think six on the top. Okay. Have you, have you took any leaks with it? I mean, it seems like it would, seems like it would actually bend that body just above it. I mean, it’s going to, uh, you know, go to your, your first weakest point, which would be just under your door. It seems like,(…) well no, because of the way that it’s attached underneath, um, it’s actually grabbing. So where the pinch seam is, you’ve got two layers of steel and then the bottom, which is the, um, the hat section that your, your body mounts are in that hat, hat section is actually structural part of the unibody. So it attaches to both the structure of the unibody and then up the side. Um, I’ve seen, I’ve seen like people run a red light and T bone, those rocker guards and no damage to the Jeep. Yeah. I’ve, I’ve, I’ve taken some, well, uh, when I was just at s’more, I landed hard on it, slid down, landed hard on them. And, and I was, I mean, hard enough to where I looked cause I was worried and, and didn’t didn’t do a thing to them. And, uh, they, and, and the bottom, the P the piece that goes under the bottom of the tub is it’s a good, solid, it’s a solid piece that goes all the way to the frame. Oh, okay. I got you. It’s, it’s a big, it’s a big play. And it’s not just a single plate. It’s a, a lot of it is double plated is this kind of a, uh,(…) how do I, it’s like a box. I don’t know how to, you know, like a, you know, like a thin. Yeah. The way they do it, it’s kind of boxed in and it has internal gussets in it as well. So it really, really distributes the load. So if you take a, let’s say you take a whack right behind the driver tire, the bolt that’s in front of the rear tire eggs literally transfers the same load. So it distributes that load across the entire rocker guard, which then is distributing the load across, I don’t know how many in, or how many hundreds of inches of sheet metal and structural support. So they, they really are incredibly strong. So there’s more to it than just what it looks like. I mean, as far as underneath and brace and all that stuff. Oh yeah. Yeah. It ties into everything. It’s, um, that’s how all rocker guards used to kind of be built. So when the, the TJ guys, you know, they’re kind of like XJ guys, they pushed harder. And so they, those first rocker guards, they were designed like that. Um, you know, so early 2000s to, you know, mid 2000s, um, probably 2010 ish people were still coming up with amazing rocker guards for, for TJs. And then, you know, the JK things took over and they, they kind of copied the idea for a while. But like I said earlier, when the JL came out, a lot of companies just started going to the pinch seam and kind of ditched the the big engineering behind them because they sell more parts, right? It’s cheaper to manufacture and cheaper to engineer and you sell just as many of them. Wealth is stop putting in as much effort. Yeah. There’s a lot more people that it’s going to be able to do a bolt on than they will be able to. Yeah. Oh, let me, uh, let me jump over to Steve. The bolt on it, the engineering put behind it. Let me jump over to, let me jump over to Steve. Cause I don’t know that Steve O has anything other than the stock, uh, Ruby rails on your Jeep. Uh, Steve, what do you have on your Jeep and are you concerned about what we’re talking about as far as, uh, cause you, you wheeled your Jeep. I just don’t know if you have anything, any concerns based on what you’ve heard tonight. No. One of the first things I did was replaced my name with a LOD.(…) There are, they’re called armor lights. Um, they’re actually aluminum, which I know Greg’s cringing right now,(…) but they have a steel, um, plate that goes along the bottom. So they’re actually get steel sliders on them and they’re frame mounted. One of the biggest things I didn’t want was I had a buddy who did, um, body mount on a jail and busted the bolt, taking it out. And I cringed. I was like, John Holman just responded. He might actually come on. Oh, that’d be great.
(…)
So I, uh, and I look at the armor lights cause of one of the reasons, as soon as they bolt on steps that come on and off that I use for my wife and daughter. So that way when I’m healing, they come off and when I’m going around town and they’re on, um, but yeah, LOD and I’m not sure if Greg’s I got the comments on LOD. LOD makes some pretty good salt stuff. There’s a lot of companies, LOD makes good stuff, but I mean, there’s really a lot of companies, you know, from JCR to, you know,
(…)
there’s lots and lots of good companies. You just got to do your research and buy what you can afford and enjoy the shit out of it. And that’s what I did. I looked at, I wanted body mount and not putting on, I wanted frame out. I didn’t want to deal with the body bolts and I didn’t want their same. So then they took the old Ruby rails off and I gave them to him. What are you? No sport. So let me jump over to F U Bob, which is his full proper name. Uh, Bob, do you have a rock sliders on your, on your TJ? And if so, uh, how did, how do they mount? Who’s are they and how did they mount?
(…)
Yeah, I have white knuckle, uh, sliders.
(…)
They, uh, are bolt on.
(…)
And, uh, I mean, anybody who’s seen the way that I drive my TJ,
(…)
they’ve survived with the guys closed.(…) They’re amazing on all those gravel roads.
(…)
No, they collect mudro. Oh yeah. Well, they probably hold up better than the radiator. Yeah. It’s a radiator guard. Well, I’m in the sliders though. That’s the difference.
(…)
So you got to go more than two miles an hour. I’m sure I’m going to need the shoes.
(…)
I don’t know that that Jeep had rested on those a couple of times. So Bob is with needed to stay quiet. Like he wasn’t there.
(…)
It was not a set up, Bob. I guarantee you. It wasn’t a set up. We call in on you.
(…)
Oh, I got no problem with it. Oh, I know you don’t, but it’s either do we feel funny. All right. So Travis, are you back or are you watching TV? Are you paying attention to the show? Cause I’d like to know what, uh, what you’re doing to your, uh, your new Jeep, your diesel, uh, JLU. Adding quotation.
(…)
He’s not figured that way. Yeah. He’s, he’s coming to the game room. Yeah. I’m coming to camera.
(…)
Hey, can he borrow some of yours, Rick? You have extra flotation, don’t you? Yeah. I got, I, I have flotation devices for everybody. Emergency floating ducks.
(…)
Bob trying to claw back. Just be quiet, Bob.
(…)
Travis. What are you, what are you going? Uh, what sliders do you have on your, uh, on your bail? You, your diesel jail.
(…)
I’ve got the motor bill. Well, when I purchased it, I had the, uh, retractable up and down, uh, amp and I immediately sold the one marketplace, uh, because they would get completely destroyed. Um, if they were rock slides, I may have kept them just to see, but they were the amp and they’re just, they’re a show up and down ball crawler. In my opinion, I could be wrong,(…) but that’s what I feel about those. So I put my motor belts back on. Um, and it’s a full underbelly. It’s, it’s a rock slide.(…) Um, and then on my YJ, I have wizard works off road, which is a body mount, well, full, uh,
(…)
side protection as well. Um, the wizard works on the YJ, I think are the best,
(…)
even though that doesn’t run or ever see a trail. Um, they’re just, they’re a true solid, uh,(…) true solid rock slide. And these motor belts have definitely been beat up and used and scratched and damaged. And I was painting them, you know, before I put them on to make sure I don’t have any rust issues, but they are solid and with the weight of this already,
(…)
I’m very, very happy to have them on and we’ll continue to beat them up. Cool.(…) All right. So, uh, John, I don’t know, uh, John Cooper, I don’t know if you want to get in on this, uh, this conversation. Do you have a, have sliders on your Jeep? And if so, uh, what kind?
(…)
You’re not, we treated Bobby’s not answering.
(…)
How about you, Dan? Uh, Dan, what are you, what are you running?(…) I’ve got the DB eight’s online and so far,
(…)
what’s that dented once dented once they’re doing their jobs better. That’s in my body.(…) Um, they’re a frame mounted as well as pincy mounted. So I wanted both and not one or the other, but you know, except for the coding, like everything else, you know, it’s not, they’re not the cheapest. They’re not the most expensive.(…) So any of the coatings are going to be questionable. So I’ve had to touch them up and repaint them. But other than that, they’re, I think I might’ve actually torqued one, twist it up. Like Greg was mentioning,(…) not quite as bad where it’s going to catch the door, but I noticed, uh, looks like it might have been tweaked at Moab last year. Yeah. Those coatings don’t handle that trip across the ocean as well as they used to know
(…)
that saltwater page plays havoc.(…) What about, what is the price point? You know, we were talking about not expensive, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh. Like the mobile builds. What, what does this set of mobile, uh,(…) rock slides? Well, they generally cost while they run it. The mind, the ones I have, which are the retail size, the time to the body and the frame, they were about 1200. And that’s, that’s raw, the three 16. So I had it. I got them powder coated on the, on the top and thing on the bottom so that I can retouch them off.
(…)
Wow. I wonder what they calls for TJs. Mine were nine 50 for my two door. Dang. I thought you guys had me in the bougie category with the generate stuff. Mine were only 800. I think I got them. I got them delivered for like seven 50.
(…)
That’s like a third of the material though. So you’re still got the bougie side. Here’s like two feet long. Two and a half feet long. So 800 bucks for a third of the material. I think you still win the bougie. Damn it. Math. I don’t know. Here’s, here’s a set for you. And this, this’ll blow you away at the cost of these. Turn your camera on. Turn your camera on. Why does it keep turning off? I think when you go to your SMS text messages, when you’re text messaging people, I think it switches off. Oh, so this set here and you know, it’s for TJ, but. I think it’s for TJ. Yeah. I think it’s for TJ. And you know, it’s for TJ, but sitting here on the floor.
(…)
So this set and there’s a lot of custom work, right? Because they’re not specifically designed for a brute until I made them that way.(…) So this set is about $5,300.
(…)
So this, this wins the bougie award. Good God. You know, the rock climbing award. Yeah. So, so they were about two grand, um, before all the costs.
(…)
About 30, 40 hours of custom fab and then repowder coating. He’s added the Henderson. For that pair. He’s added the Henderson cost to it. I got it.
(…)
So one, one, one, uh, follow up question then for the, Tony’s and the, the riches and stuff.(…) Obviously y’all don’t frame out your XJ sliders. Okay.
(…)
Um,(…) my, my XJ slider is attached to the unibody and plug weld.
(…)
So it can’t be attached to the frame, but it’s damn close. So it’s on the side that it connects to the body. It’s the, the, the unibody with plug welds and on the outside it’s attached to the pinch seams.
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Yeah. Just want to throw that out there. Cause we were using the term frame mounted a lot and body mounted. So there’s a, you can’t do anything but body mount. Exactly.
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But it’s not the same body mouth as we’re talking about on the JKs and the JLs and stuff.(…) It’s a little different.
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What Greg, I got a question for you when it comes to like, so like I said before, I’m basically, I mean, I got the Ruby rails with the step mounted to them. I mean, it’s frame mounted body mount, but I also added, um, like medical.
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It was a remote to the body mounts. Sorry. Yup. They’re wired anyway. Anyways, I added, um, metal metal, metal cloaks, got the, the, the skid floor, the armor that goes across the entire rocker panel. And then by doing that, I mean, my steps are within probably a 16th of an inch or less from that skid plate. I mean, in some ways that, that, that could actually be making them a little bit stronger. Cause now instead of having like a quarter inch gap in there, if I do land on something, I mean, it’s transferring that weight from the step to the, to the armor, which is also then transferring it across the, across the side, the Jeep, just not into one spot. I mean,(…) that would that be a true statement or am I wrong?
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Well, it’s just distributing the load a little bit more because the added armor, but they’re still attached the same way. But honestly, the factory Rubicon rocker guards, um,(…) they’re not bad, right? I mean, they’re really not bad. They’re, they’re designed to, they’re designed to hold up the entire weight of the vehicle. So,(…) I mean, they’re not, they might not be as good as some of the aftermarket stuff, but they’re still good. And you added some more structural support. So they’re stronger than the way that they left the factory. Well, and you know, and then there’s other things too. Like, I mean, I have this, the under the underbody or the skid plate and the metal cloaks under the skid, uh, whatever the undercloaks skid plate, which adds the boat tail to the under the side of the frame, which, you know, that’s actually making less of an angle, kind of like a departure angle, you know, when you’re coming off something. So maybe, you know, if I’m landing on just the step or just the rocker guard, sure, I’d probably, it might take some real damage, but if, if it, if it lands on the, uh, if it’s far enough,(…) if the object is far enough under the vehicle, it’s not going to just hit the rocker guard. It’s going to hit the skid plate. It’s going to hit the Ruby rail. It’s going to hit everything all at once. So I guess there’s multiple different scenarios where, you know, just simply falling off over a four foot ledge. Are you landing on just the rocker guard?
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Well, it depends on how it lands, but yeah, you know, I mean, there’s nothing wrong with any of them, right? The only thing that’s wrong is people who don’t have any of it and try and go off-road. So yeah, that’s true. Enjoy the shit out of it. And if, and when you damage it, you’re going to upgrade, right? So, and you’ve been behind the wheel much more than a lot of newbies. Um, you know, you’ve, you’ve done some pretty hardcore stuff. I mean, you did it, you ran pritch it with it and some other, you know, amazing trails. So as long as you have some form of rocker protection, you’re better off than none. Absolutely. You definitely don’t want to be doing this stuff. Yeah. Rocker protect. You can fly. You got as a pinch seals, a pinch seam showing. I said earlier.
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Yeah, I said it earlier.
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Run with what you’re comfortable with. Run with what you’re comfortable with spending.
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And, and just enjoy it, right? That’s what makes this hobby great is nobody’s right. Nobody’s wrong.(…) Everybody can explore the Jeep in their own way.
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You know, from the bougiest shit in the world to schedule 40 black pipe welded to your frame, right? It all works as long as it’s in your wheelhouse and you’re willing to, you know, make the upgrade when you need it. There’s, there’s always a plan B and that’s cut it all off and put both sides on it. Yeah. Both sides of the fucking world.
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All right. So, uh, Derek, I don’t know if you had any more, you seem to jump in there when you need to, but I wanted to go to you really quick to make sure you didn’t have something in addition that you wanted to say. And, uh, what were you waiting for? I think so. I think mine’s pretty covered.(…) I just, I just, I was kind of like, like Greg earlier, like, um,(…) you know, I kind of had that first impression of, you know, well, it’s either weld on or nothing, but, you know, if we’re trying to help people out and get the word out to like, you know, just do what you can afford, you know, I think that’s, that’s the ticket. Yeah. Yeah. You’re gonna, you know, if you’re, if you’re wheeling, you’re gonna make,
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you’re gonna fuck something up, but it’s just a matter of, you know, what do you have? What can you afford? You know, and if you mess it up, then you just, you learn from it and try to get, get what you can. So do the best you can is what I’m hearing from a few of you. And the problem I have with that, let me see if this is, this is a bad comparison. So you go to buy a Jeep and you can get a Wrangler, but it’s really expensive(…) or you can get a Renegade, which is a lot cheaper. Do you, do you do what you can afford or do you collect a few more aluminum cans and get that Wrangler? Because that’s kind of what we’re talking about here on this, on the protection. I don’t think the, even the Renegade has a trail rated bed. So who cares? Right? Look at, look at the guys with liberties that are going out and just destroying the world. Look at the guy with the $2,000, the guy with the $2,000 XJ that just destroys everything. Right. Run what you run. Come out and enjoy the people. XJ is a different beast. I guarantee you. It’s a TJ on a station wagon body.
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Well, what we’re really talking about is what we’re willing to accept as far as a risk factor. It’s like, you know, when I rode a motorcycle that some guys would leather up and body, body armor up and helmet. And I mean, oh, you got a bicycle. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I mean, just full blown flip flops and shorts. Yep. And then you got the next guy with flip flop shorts and not wearing a, not wearing a helmet at all, or, you know, the reverse suspenders. Yeah. There you go. So, you know, it’s, it’s a risk assessment and what you’re willing to take on as a risk and, and, and we all do the best we can as far as, you know, we all want, you know, none of us want to tear our crap up. We spend too much money, blood, sweat, and tears putting into it. And it’ll be, so just tear it up. So to be clear, I don’t feel that the Jeep talks to his job is to tell you what you should buy. I think our job here is to make sure you understand what the options are to edumacate you and what you can do or what’s acceptable. I think everybody understands that at some level, you have to do what you find accessible accessible for you and what you can afford. But I think it’s important to understand that if you’re going to be doing things, there is a absolute right way of doing it. And the rest of it is compromise.(…) And I, that, that might be the wrong statement. You guys can disagree with it, but that’s the way I look at it. There’s a right way and there’s a compromised way. But what do you want to do and doing the compromised way doesn’t mean you can’t go to something that does the right way in the future. So I’m glad we had this discussion and let me see, I was going to go with one of the person. I want to make sure that they got everything in. Let’s see. It wasn’t Dan. It wasn’t Derek. Bob, we don’t want to talk to him again.(…) We didn’t get John earlier. John, I want to check with you real quick. Make sure that you didn’t want to jump in here real quick before we wrap up.(…) John’s in here for the headcount. I think so.(…) Yeah, I was going to say, I was going to say one more thing, you know, I guess what, what, yeah, what some of this conversation might help people with is, is there’s, there’s definitely different levels, but then there’s also some that you just want to run away from. You know, you don’t, there’s some that you, if you’re expecting some, a little bit more than the average protection, there are some that you just want to run away from because they’re not going to do it. Would everybody agree that the Chinese built stuff you want to stay away from?
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Yeah. The Chinese is not very good. Yeah. Not very good for you.
(…)
You can only, if you can only get a couple of bucks in aluminum out of them when you destroy them, they’re probably worth buying.(…) Yeah.(…) All right guys. Well, we do this every week. Uh, and we really would like to have you here. Uh, and, uh, you never can tell, uh, there’s several big names in the industry that know about the, the show cause, uh, Greg, uh, Greg one, uh, sent them text messages. All of them had to wash their hair. They weren’t available, uh, to be here on the show tonight, but, uh, at least they know about the other roundtable. So we may see them here in the future. All right. That’s a wrap for this week’s Jeep talk show roundtable. A big thank you to all of our zoom participants. You guys make this so much fun and informative every week and informative. I think we should underline cause we have a lot of people with a lot of good information here and Roger. So, uh, we really appreciate you being here. Travis is just glad you’re here, Roger. Cause they’re used to pick on Travis all the time. Yeah. Remember you can join us again, Tuesday, next Tuesday at seven 30 PM Pacific time for more G talk random questions and always a few rabbit trails. Don’t forget to visit jeep talk show.com slash contact to find out how you can be part of the conversation. Thanks again. And we’ll see you next week. And in a reminder, it’s the second nature to me. We record on Tuesday, we publish on Wednesday. So if you missed the roundtable on Tuesday, you can listen or view the show on YouTube or rumble, uh, on, on Wednesday. So check us out and have a good time. So, uh, we now return this zoom meeting to regular.
Broadcasting Sense 2010
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You’re my friend, you’re my new friend.